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Disk Brakes For Mitsubishi Jeep J44??


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#1 awk220

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Posted 28 August 2009 - 10:47 PM

Hi guys , iam just wondering is it possible to do a disk brake conversion to j44 model jeep?

#2 Janith Seneviratne

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Posted 11 September 2009 - 09:12 PM

i heard there are mitsubishi jeeps with disc brakes, so i think its possible,
but converting to disc is waste of money for old jeeps, just use brakes with larger booster u'll be fine, do it if u really want it

Edited by Janith Seneviratne, 11 September 2009 - 09:15 PM.

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#3 kjk

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Posted 13 September 2009 - 12:34 PM

one of my friend he is having j24.he did it.... its kind of wasting money....

#4 Janith Seneviratne

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 08:34 PM

QUOTE (awk220 @ Aug 28 2009, 10:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hi guys , iam just wondering is it possible to do a disk brake conversion to j44 model jeep?

as i know the best way is to put a diff with disc breaks to it, there are dana30 and 44 diffs with disc breaks
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#5 Watchman

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 11:55 PM

QUOTE (Janith Seneviratne @ Feb 12 2010, 10:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
as i know the best way is to put a diff with disc breaks to it, there are dana30 and 44 diffs with disc breaks


Like Janith says fit a bigger servo. Thats what we did on ours and dam those brakes stick!

#6 harshansenadhir

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 12:02 AM

QUOTE (Janith Seneviratne @ Feb 12 2010, 09:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
as i know the best way is to put a diff with disc breaks to it, there are dana30 and 44 diffs with disc breaks

someone said waste of money to fit disk brakes? I second that coz the brake booster of jeep is small and will not provide enough power to stop disks. It's designed to stop drum brakes as expanded brake liners of drum system uses resistance and motion power of the drum itself to increase braking power. Installing disk brakes will require a new powerfull booster. After all success factor of disks will reduce as weight increases and that's why heavy applications comes with drum brakes as oppose to disks. Replace liners and adjust all four liners properly, phase the drums and bingo, you have a better brake system with a booster.

Edited by harshansenadhir, 13 February 2010 - 12:04 AM.

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#7 Janith Seneviratne

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 10:49 PM

QUOTE (harshansenadhir @ Feb 13 2010, 12:02 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
someone said waste of money to fit disk brakes? I second that coz the brake booster of jeep is small and will not provide enough power to stop disks. It's designed to stop drum brakes as expanded brake liners of drum system uses resistance and motion power of the drum itself to increase braking power. Installing disk brakes will require a new powerfull booster. After all success factor of disks will reduce as weight increases and that's why heavy applications comes with drum brakes as oppose to disks. Replace liners and adjust all four liners properly, phase the drums and bingo, you have a better brake system with a booster.


i dnt have disc's in my one but im not using the factory booster ones, n i hv much better break on the road, but theres a but, when i go in mud breaks dnt wrk properly and last time i checked my liners hv fell off the shoe's this time i riveted the liners so need to check again, but as disc break kit i heard theres a brembo like disc break conversion kit for dana 30(front) and dana 44(rear) called wilwood nice break system colored calipers like in an STi and ventilated disc awesome stuff put pricey each pair gona cost around 900 to 1000 dollars so for both diff's $2000 doesnt worth it for a 4dr5, better use a bigger servo and the diff with bigger drums (dtz wt i did)
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#8 Hoonigan

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 04:26 PM

Guys,

 

Bumping this thread up to get some feedback on brake mods.

 

1. Is it worthwhile to convert rear drums to discs? Larger surface area than the existing drums of course. I take it that a drum will have the same stopping power of a disc that is the same size?

 

2. Is it worthwhile to use larger rotor in the front and keep the stock caliper (relocated with a bracket)

 

3. Or is it just a matter of running a larger booster as mentioned above?

 

Other Details;

This is for the Capri and I'm planning this ahead because of the extra weight at the front from the replacement engine and the extra power. A set(4) of vented Sierra Discs can be bought for under £75 apparetly, which has 283mm front rotors compared to the 240mm stock.

 

Thanks :)


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#9 The Don

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 05:32 PM

Guys,

 

Bumping this thread up to get some feedback on brake mods.

 

1. Is it worthwhile to convert rear drums to discs? Larger surface area than the existing drums of course. I take it that a drum will have the same stopping power of a disc that is the same size?

 

2. Is it worthwhile to use larger rotor in the front and keep the stock caliper (relocated with a bracket)

 

3. Or is it just a matter of running a larger booster as mentioned above?

 

Other Details;

This is for the Capri and I'm planning this ahead because of the extra weight at the front from the replacement engine and the extra power. A set(4) of vented Sierra Discs can be bought for under £75 apparetly, which has 283mm front rotors compared to the 240mm stock.

 

Thanks :)

 

Hi Hoonigan,

 

If you are going for bigger brakes, remember its not just a matter of fitting on bigger discs.

 

In your case, you would probably need

 

1. The sierra hubs, adapted to fit the capri

2. Siera calipers (because they would fit the siera hubs nicely)

3. Bigger servo

4. Possibly newer rims if the old rims can't cope with bigger discs

 

You can update to a bigger disc and keep the existing caliper, but this is only possible if you already have discs already or the hub will take a disc without too much modification

 

Another easier upgrade if you have discs is to update the number of pots you have in the caliper and say fit 4 pot calipers. This will give you more braking power at the cost of faster wear of discs of course.  To be honest this is the most practical update as it requires the least modification (only calipers).



#10 Hoonigan

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 08:08 PM

Hi Hoonigan,

 

If you are going for bigger brakes, remember its not just a matter of fitting on bigger discs.

 

In your case, you would probably need

 

1. The sierra hubs, adapted to fit the capri

2. Siera calipers (because they would fit the siera hubs nicely)

3. Bigger servo

4. Possibly newer rims if the old rims can't cope with bigger discs

 

You can update to a bigger disc and keep the existing caliper, but this is only possible if you already have discs already or the hub will take a disc without too much modification

 

Another easier upgrade if you have discs is to update the number of pots you have in the caliper and say fit 4 pot calipers. This will give you more braking power at the cost of faster wear of discs of course.  To be honest this is the most practical update as it requires the least modification (only calipers).

 

Thanks Don, I assumed that I could get away with the stock hubs as the Sierra has the same PCD. And I already have 16 inch wheels ready to go on so I didn't imagine any clearance issues there. as per the scenario you pointed out, swapping out better calipers seems to be the more economical route. I suppose I can look at non Ford calipers?

 

also, if I go four pot in the front, should I up the size of the rear brakes (which would involve a disc conversion I suppose?)


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#11 The Don

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 10:11 PM

Thanks Don, I assumed that I could get away with the stock hubs as the Sierra has the same PCD. And I already have 16 inch wheels ready to go on so I didn't imagine any clearance issues there. as per the scenario you pointed out, swapping out better calipers seems to be the more economical route. I suppose I can look at non Ford calipers?

 

also, if I go four pot in the front, should I up the size of the rear brakes (which would involve a disc conversion I suppose?)

 

Well if a bolt on kit is available then it might be an option. There are a lot of kits and resources available for the capri.

 

Well if the Siera kits fit, you can look for the kits from the Cosworth RS.

 

The front and the rear brakes do not need to be upgraded at the same time as long as the rears provide adequate braking. All that will happen is the front might stop the car quicker than before, which is not an issue. The bigger issue is when the rears lock up before the fronts fully bite, because then the rear can give way and slide around.

 

How big are the rear drums?

 

Try to look for an entire kit rather than just buying parts. Remember the discs are usually fairly cheap. Its the calipers that are expensive, so a kit might end up being cheaper, because it will come with the forged parts for mounting.



#12 Hoonigan

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 12:10 AM

Well if a bolt on kit is available then it might be an option. There are a lot of kits and resources available for the capri.

 

Well if the Siera kits fit, you can look for the kits from the Cosworth RS.

 

The front and the rear brakes do not need to be upgraded at the same time as long as the rears provide adequate braking. All that will happen is the front might stop the car quicker than before, which is not an issue. The bigger issue is when the rears lock up before the fronts fully bite, because then the rear can give way and slide around.

 

How big are the rear drums?

 

Try to look for an entire kit rather than just buying parts. Remember the discs are usually fairly cheap. Its the calipers that are expensive, so a kit might end up being cheaper, because it will come with the forged parts for mounting.

 

There are bolt on kits for the fronts offered, with machined mounts as you say, but are north of £600, which is a bit too much for me. The 283mm front rotors were Cossie gear. A set of Mintex discs can be had for under £75 as you said, much cheaper. 

 

I found this article along the way, according to which, I won't need the hubs. But it's based on both disc and caliper swaps (not like my more ghetto proposition :S )

 

http://capriwiki.com...80mm_Conversion

 

I'm not sure about the rear drum size but I doubt it will lock up before the fronts fully engage. My worry was if the rears don't help out, the car will nose dive at every tap of the brake

 

I'm on the lookout for a used kit anyways, which at a decent price would be a no brainer but as you surely know, UK isn't the cheapest place for cheap car parts :(


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#13 The Don

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 04:35 PM

There are bolt on kits for the fronts offered, with machined mounts as you say, but are north of £600, which is a bit too much for me. The 283mm front rotors were Cossie gear. A set of Mintex discs can be had for under £75 as you said, much cheaper. 

 

I found this article along the way, according to which, I won't need the hubs. But it's based on both disc and caliper swaps (not like my more ghetto proposition :S )

 

http://capriwiki.com...80mm_Conversion

 

I'm not sure about the rear drum size but I doubt it will lock up before the fronts fully engage. My worry was if the rears don't help out, the car will nose dive at every tap of the brake

 

I'm on the lookout for a used kit anyways, which at a decent price would be a no brainer but as you surely know, UK isn't the cheapest place for cheap car parts :(

The problem is these kits are custom made and the market is small, so for them to recoup their costs they need to price accordingly.

 

If you find a Capri breaking, then you might be able to get the parts off it. The problem is I don't trust Sri Lankan machine shop quality for forging new parts without a template. There are concerns around balance etc (like how the discs sit on the hub, how the calipers are aligned against the disc and the hub).

 

If you have a big engine in the front, you will find the car to be quite nose heavy to begin with, so expect understeer and nose dives. You will need to upgrade the springs and the shocks to compensate, but while that might control the nose dives, still the balance of the car would be towards the front. Nothing much you can do about that I'm afraid... unless you find a lighter power plant :(



#14 Hoonigan

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 05:05 PM

The problem is these kits are custom made and the market is small, so for them to recoup their costs they need to price accordingly.

 

If you find a Capri breaking, then you might be able to get the parts off it. The problem is I don't trust Sri Lankan machine shop quality for forging new parts without a template. There are concerns around balance etc (like how the discs sit on the hub, how the calipers are aligned against the disc and the hub).

 

If you have a big engine in the front, you will find the car to be quite nose heavy to begin with, so expect understeer and nose dives. You will need to upgrade the springs and the shocks to compensate, but while that might control the nose dives, still the balance of the car would be towards the front. Nothing much you can do about that I'm afraid... unless you find a lighter power plant  :(

 

Went through too much trouble for this engine to bail on it now I'm afraid. The MK1's heaviest engine was the Essex 3.0. I think the 2.8i Cologne will be around the same weight if not marginally lighter. So I hope it won't be a stretch for the MK1 body.I am yet to find any details about a similar set up (MK3 V6 in a MK1 body) to get an idea about what the end product may look/drive like.

 

I got down the MK3 2.8 injection's struts with the shipment but the inserts are shot. The Injection Special had Billie inserts, which are again expensive even in used condition. The mechanic assured that he will figure it out when we get to that stage with new inserts and the two sets of coils we have. Thinking of a Rally Design coilover conversion kit. Between that, strut braces and possibly a set of Poly bushings, I'm hoping to get the car to behave a little better.

 

But as you mentioned, it will still be a nose heavy car packing old tech, and my expectations should be adjusted accordingly. The best route about the brakes I understand is to wait and find someting in kit form with minimal fabrication work required. Thank you for your input which is much appreciated :)


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#15 The Don

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 05:25 PM

Went through too much trouble for this engine to bail on it now I'm afraid. The MK1's heaviest engine was the Essex 3.0. I think the 2.8i Cologne will be around the same weight if not marginally lighter. So I hope it won't be a stretch for the MK1 body.I am yet to find any details about a similar set up (MK3 V6 in a MK1 body) to get an idea about what the end product may look/drive like.

 

I got down the MK3 2.8 injection's struts with the shipment but the inserts are shot. The Injection Special had Billie inserts, which are again expensive even in used condition. The mechanic assured that he will figure it out when we get to that stage with new inserts and the two sets of coils we have. Thinking of a Rally Design coilover conversion kit. Between that, strut braces and possibly a set of Poly bushings, I'm hoping to get the car to behave a little better.

 

But as you mentioned, it will still be a nose heavy car packing old tech, and my expectations should be adjusted accordingly. The best route about the brakes I understand is to wait and find someting in kit form with minimal fabrication work required. Thank you for your input which is much appreciated :)

 

Well you can somewhat counter the nose issues by adjusting the camber, but that will result in greater tyre wear. Its a common problem, present in most modern cars as well, especially seen in Diesels which are heavier engines. But the extra torque kind of counteracts the issues somewhat. At least you won't get torque steer as the car is rear wheel drive.

 

Having said that with the heavier power plant a brake upgrade may be mandatory, at least a more powerful servo, else you might have to stand up to slow the car down because of the weight. I assume you are also going for a staggered setup of wheels with the backs being wider than the fronts?



#16 Hoonigan

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 05:56 PM

Well you can somewhat counter the nose issues by adjusting the camber, but that will result in greater tyre wear. Its a common problem, present in most modern cars as well, especially seen in Diesels which are heavier engines. But the extra torque kind of counteracts the issues somewhat. At least you won't get torque steer as the car is rear wheel drive.

 

Having said that with the heavier power plant a brake upgrade may be mandatory, at least a more powerful servo, else you might have to stand up to slow the car down because of the weight. I assume you are also going for a staggered setup of wheels with the backs being wider than the fronts?

 

Yup, a bigger servo is definitely going in, at the very least. I'm trying my best to sort out the rest of the braking system in one go.

 

Already got the tyres down, 255 rear 205 front. And yes, I got the power steering rack form the MK3 as well :)


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